Podcast Source: Empire

Compiled & Edited by: Shenchao TechFlow

Guest: Wang Qiao

Host: Jason Yano

Original Title: Claude Opus 4.5’s Breakout Moment & Investing in 2026 with Qiao Wang

Broadcast Date: January 12, 2026

Key Takeaways

This week, Qiao Wang joined the show to discuss how artificial intelligence will redefine what it means to be an investor in 2026. We delved into the breakthrough moment of Claude Opus 4.5, why Qiao chose to invest in Google, how to build an investment portfolio for 2026, and how to allocate time wisely in the age of artificial intelligence.

Highlights of Insights

• The current market sentiment is overly optimistic.
• “About 40% of my portfolio is in cash.”
• The appeal of crypto tokens is limited, but there will always be opportunities in the market; focus on analyzing assets individually rather than just looking at the overall asset class.
• The ratio of stocks to Bitcoin in my holdings is about 50/50.
• My largest investment is in Google, and I also hold shares in Tencent, which is an excellent company.
• A currently overlooked area by the market is AI-driven biotechnology; the potential of AI in biotechnology is enormous.
• By 2026, we may see some unicorn startups with only one or two people.
• Some of the most successful AI startups are not companies like ChatGPT or OpenAI, but rather small businesses leveraging AI.
• The essence of a company's moat has not changed, but the moat in the software sector is rapidly weakening.
• Code itself is no longer the bottleneck; the key lies in designing the right prompts.
• The value of Gemini is underestimated by at least two orders of magnitude. “I would be willing to pay Gemini a monthly fee of $2,000.”
• I think Adobe could be this year's Google because its current valuation is very cheap, and the market's perception of it is somewhat similar to how it viewed Google back then.
• Everyone should learn to code, and it is essential; people can use automation tools to optimize certain aspects of their lives and work.
• AI tools will make those who are already efficient and capable even more efficient and smarter.
• In terms of health, the three fundamental factors remain the most important: diet, sleep, and exercise.

Qiao's 2026 Investment Portfolio

Yano: About a month ago, you mentioned the current state of the market and expressed some level of concern. You also referenced the internet bubble period, like in 1996, when some predicted the market was about to peak, yet it continued to rise for three more years.

Additionally, I saw a tweet of yours discussing the relationship between forward P/E ratios and returns over the next decade. You raised some counterpoints, but ultimately you said, “I still feel scared.” I’m curious, what is your current view of the market?

Qiao:

I feel scared because the current market sentiment is overly optimistic. While I can't say everyone feels this way, you can see many people on social media flaunting their investment gains, especially with the market fluctuations over the past week; this sentiment is indeed very apparent. From a quantitative perspective, current market valuations are nearing historical highs. Of course, some will argue that companies today are more profitable, have stronger competitive advantages, and that the economic structure is more stable, coupled with monetary easing policies driving the market, making current valuations reasonable. But regardless, we cannot deny that market valuations are indeed at historical peaks. Therefore, I have not fully committed to risk assets. In fact, about 40% of my portfolio is in cash. While I might miss some opportunities if the market continues to rise, at least I can sleep more soundly.

Yano: I listened to an interview with Drucker and Muller, where he mentioned, “In my 50 years of investing, this is the hardest time to predict market trends.” If even Drucker can't predict, how can we ordinary investors do it?

Qiao:

That’s why I focus more on stock selection. If you look at the overall market, valuations are indeed high, but if you study individual companies one by one, you may find some very attractive investment opportunities. This way, even if the overall market declines, your fear will lessen. During the internet bubble in 2000, although tech stocks performed poorly in the following decade, small-cap and value stocks did very well, with an average annual growth rate of 10%. I believe this is the best time for stock pickers.

Yano: What is your view on investing in stocks and crypto tokens right now?

Qiao:

Currently, I think the appeal of crypto tokens is limited, but there will always be opportunities in the market, like in 2022 when many investment opportunities arose. Therefore, I am still focused on analyzing assets individually rather than just looking at the overall asset class. From a broad perspective, there are almost no particularly attractive assets right now, except for the dollar. But if you analyze assets one by one, you might find some opportunities. As for cryptocurrencies, I still hold some Bitcoin and a small amount of tokens, but the overall investment proportion is very small.

Yano:If we try to break down your investment portfolio, 40% is cash; how much of the remaining 60% is in stocks and cryptocurrencies? What is the ratio of Bitcoin to other crypto assets?

Qiao:

Between stocks and Bitcoin, it’s about 50/50. I still hold a significant amount of Bitcoin, but this is not my ideal investment portfolio because if I sell Bitcoin, I would incur high taxes, and the proportion of crypto tokens is very small, less than 1%.

Yano:What stocks are you currently holding?

Qiao:

My largest investment is in Google, and I also hold shares in Tencent. Tencent is an excellent company; although its business is relatively low-key, its fundamentals are very solid.

Yano:Do you think Tencent is better than Alibaba?

Qiao:

Currently, yes. Alibaba has more advantages in AI, but its retail business is highly competitive. I also hold some Amazon stock. I think last year's market sentiment was very unfavorable for Amazon because all the tech giants' stock prices rose, while Amazon lagged. Additionally, I am very optimistic about Amazon's developments in robotics. These investments are all long-term, with a goal of ten years.

Yano:Amazon is indeed leading in robotics; they may become the first large company with more robotic employees than human employees.

Qiao:

In the past five years, the number of human employees at Amazon has remained stable, while the number of robotic employees has grown by 20% to 30%. They have significantly improved their profit margins in recent years, despite not having high revenue growth.

Yano: In the healthcare sector, what are your thoughts on companies like Eli Lilly or others?

Qiao:

I hold some Eli Lilly stock, but this is a short-term trade rather than a long-term investment because I have limited knowledge of the pharmaceutical industry. I don’t know what will happen in ten years; I know I might still be using Amazon in ten years, but there are too many competitors in the pharmaceutical industry. Although Eli Lilly has strong patent barriers, there are many cheap and effective gray market Chinese peptides that directly compete with Eli Lilly.

I believe a currently overlooked area by the market is AI-driven biotechnology. While everyone is focusing on robotics, drones, and AI chatbots, I think the potential of AI in biotechnology is enormous.

Yano:What are your thoughts on the automotive and fintech sectors? Do you hold stocks in Tesla or Rivian?

Qiao:

No, Tesla's valuation is too high, and I don't know much about Rivian yet.

Yano:What about the fintech sector? For example, Robinhood and Coinbase?

Qiao:

From a valuation perspective, I think Coinbase is more attractive, but neither company is particularly excellent as an investment. I hold shares in Coinbase, while Robinhood's valuation is too high.

Yano:Do you think someone in the West will develop a super app similar to "WeChat"?

Qiao:

Are you referring to a super app that integrates messaging, payments, social networking, and other functions like WeChat? I think there is already a trend in the financial sector, like with Robinhood. But if it’s a super app that comprehensively covers all aspects of life like WeChat, I don’t see that possibility at the moment.

Claude Opus 4.5’s Breakout Moment

Yano: I want to talk about Claude and Opus 4.5. I think the best entry point is to mention what you said on Twitter about a “wow, this is it” moment. Over the past few years, there have been a few similar moments that gave me the same feeling: one was the release of ChatGPT, another was the first reasoning model, and then there was Tesla's FSD V13 (full self-driving). Why do you think Opus 4.5 is a “wow” moment?

Qiao:

I can't explain what happened behind it, but I can tell you how I feel as a user. The last time I wrote code was probably a year ago, but I haven't seriously written code in three years. From 2010 to 2017, before entering the cryptocurrency space, I was engaged in quantitative trading, writing code daily, from ultra-low-level C++ to more advanced Python data science code. This was my field for seven years, and I also wrote some front-end and back-end code. But since leaving Messari, I haven't seriously written code; in recent years, I've only done some personal projects, taking time at the end of each year to work on them.

Opus 4.5 is different from before; previously, you could quickly assemble a demo, but the last 5% was always difficult for AI to complete fully, requiring an excellent engineer to handle the details, such as errors and edge cases. In Opus 4.5, I just need to tell it what I want to do in simple English, provide a very clear specification, and as long as the specification is clear and comprehensive enough, it can complete it all at once.

Claude and Opus may be experiencing a hype cycle on Twitter, as I have engineer friends telling me that OpenAI's latest GPT-5 Pro is almost as good as Claude.

Yano:

I've used both, but Opus is actually the tool that made me switch from ChatGPT for the first time. For me, ChatGPT's memory feature made me so reliant on it that I felt I might use it forever because it knows everything about me, but now Opus 4.5 is better for me.

There is now a new way of working, and I'm not sure how to categorize it as a chatbot because the boundaries between the two are becoming blurred. For example, I just completed a task using Opus 4.5. We have a sales team of eight at Blockworks, and typically we need to decide who should be responsible for each account and prioritize the accounts, such as Tier 1, Tier 2, etc. Each salesperson has their own judgment, for example, someone might handle 10 Tier 1, 30 Tier 2, and 100 Tier 3 accounts. This allocation work is often complex. So, I handed this problem to Claude and asked it to consolidate the relevant information. I told it that if a token's FDV (Fully Diluted Valuation) exceeds $1 billion, that account can receive additional priority; if the project corresponding to that token is a public company, even better.

Claude extracted relevant information from multiple data sources like CoinGecko and CoinMarketCap and ranked these accounts. Then, it analyzed the transaction history of each salesperson with Blockworks over the past eight years, understood the types of products we sold, and allocated accounts to the appropriate people based on the likelihood of each salesperson closing deals with those accounts.

Qiao:

During the holidays, I also realized what you mentioned about the blurring lines between general chatbots and traditional coding. When you converse with a general chatbot, it usually generates a piece of code on the fly based on your needs, and now when you need to write code, you don't even have to write it yourself; you can just express your needs in simple natural language. This is causing the functionalities of code assistants and general chatbots to gradually merge.

Yano:Absolutely right. So why don't you just use Replit or Lovelace to complete your Vibe coding work? Why choose Claude?

Qiao:

I think their target user groups are different. I haven't tried the latest version of Lovelace, but I feel that Lovelace is more suitable for users who want to quickly build a nice demo or simple application; they perform well in front-end development, although I haven't actually used it myself. So I initially used Cursor with Opus 4.5, and then I tried Claude and Opus 4.5. To be honest, I haven't felt a significant difference in terms of productivity. For me, their performance is about the same, but that's just my personal experience.

How is AI Affecting Startups?

Yano:You have witnessed the growth of thousands of crypto startups; how is AI impacting these companies now?

Qiao:

AI has a significant impact on startups, and this change has been particularly evident over the past three years. Basically, I ask in every group, especially the technical partners of each startup, how much their productivity has improved since the release of ChatGPT in 2022. Almost every time, the answer is higher than the last. This trend is very consistent. The most recent group's response was that their productivity has increased by about 3 to 4 times.

I believe this impact is more pronounced in early-stage startups, while the effect on later-stage large companies is relatively smaller, because one limitation of code assistants is their "context window." For example, suppose Claude can handle a million tokens; this means it can help you kick off a new project very efficiently and effectively. But if you ask Claude to modify the entire codebase of Google, that would be nearly impossible, right? So these tools are more helpful for early-stage small startups, while their utility is relatively limited for large companies.

In large companies, the most effective way to utilize code assistants is by establishing clear inter-departmental abstraction layers. This allows complex tasks to be broken down into smaller chunks, narrowing the context, and then inputting them into the AI system, making it easier for the system to understand.

Yano:

However, I think using the term "productivity" to describe the impact of AI is not entirely accurate, especially for early-stage startups. If you are a company with 100, 200, or even 1,000 people, a 3x or 4x increase in productivity could be a significant change. But for early-stage startups, they might not even consider "productivity." Their thinking is more along the lines of: why do we need to hire more people? I often see this situation in the companies I invest in and among my friends' startups.

They feel that since we have AI, we don't need to hire new employees at all. This phenomenon is really interesting. For example, I recently created two tools for sales: one is a sales commission calculator. The sales team often asks me how much they can earn. Previously, we needed to consult the finance team to calculate this, and the finance team found it cumbersome. Now, with this tool, the problem is solved.

The other tool is a dashboard for sales data. This tool can calculate the cost of the dashboard. Previously, we had to consult the data team and consider whether they were using Dune or Gold Sky to index the data. If neither, we had to pay extra fees. Now, I developed a dashboard cost calculator based on all ports.

What is the significance of these small tools? They mean we no longer need to hire someone specifically for sales support, so by 2026, we might see some unicorn startups with only one or two people. Such startups may have already started, and while they may not yet have reached a billion-dollar valuation, they are already growing rapidly.

Qiao:

Absolutely. I know many people who are now running subscription revenue businesses with annual revenues of $10 million on their own. These individuals are often former engineers from companies like Meta and Uber who have grown tired of the bureaucracy of large companies and have chosen to start their own ventures.

Yano:

However, I find an interesting phenomenon: some of the most successful AI startups are not companies like ChatGPT or OpenAI, but rather small businesses leveraging AI. These companies are reluctant to disclose their core business. Generally speaking, if you have a startup that is doing well and rapidly growing in revenue, you would want to tell the world to raise funds or promote it on social media.

Do Moats Still Exist?

Yano:What is your view on a company's moat? Do you think the definition of a moat will change?

Qiao:

The essence of a moat has not changed, but the moats in the software sector are indeed weakening rapidly. For early-stage startups, there is almost no moat to speak of. Companies like Facebook, Google, Microsoft, and Apple still have solid moats. AI code assistants cannot destroy these moats. For example, Apple's moat is its developer ecosystem, while Microsoft's moat is the high cost for users to switch from PCs to other platforms. In the cloud service sector, the moats of AWS, Azure, and Google GCP are the high costs of customers switching cloud platforms. Additionally, platforms like YouTube that have vast proprietary data can leverage this data to develop very powerful video models. For instance, Microsoft's enterprise software is also a super critical tool. Of course, you can replicate the functionalities of Office, but will enterprises really switch from Office to other software? For them, these tools are too important, and the switching costs are too high.

However, I recently noticed an example that might be one of the most undervalued cases in the current financial market, which is Adobe. Photoshop and Adobe's creative suite are very famous, and there is a prevailing view in the market that the latest video models and image generation models will replace Adobe's products. But I think this view is completely wrong because Adobe's moat lies in its enterprise-level integration capabilities. Many enterprise users using Adobe's creative suite store their images and videos in Adobe's cloud. For these professionals in the creative industry, the cost of switching from Adobe Cloud to other services is very high.

Moreover, many creative workers have been using Photoshop for many years, and the operation has become muscle memory. For them, switching to other tools is very difficult. Therefore, Adobe's current P/E ratio is only 12 times, which is incredibly undervalued for such a high-quality company.

Yano: Suppose you work at a company, like a startup that has been operating for ten years and has 500 employees. How should the company respond? Many young entrepreneurs may already be familiar with these technologies, but for a more mature company, it may not be so easy to adapt. Employees might just throw things into ChatGPT and then send out automated emails.

Qiao:

I believe you cannot force companies to adopt new technologies; you must let them find the immediate applications of AI technology themselves and see the significant impact it can bring. By the way, this is actually what we experienced at Alliance over the past three years. We knew three years ago that AI would become an important trend, and we proposed to become an "AI-first" organization, but we did not try to impose AI on every corner of the organization.

On the contrary, we use AI to automate some specific processes. For example, we receive thousands of applications every year. Three years ago, I had to read all the application documents myself, which amounted to about 5,000 a year. This work was very exhausting and draining. But now, we have automated about 50% of the work using AI.

Yano:How did you do it? Are you using Opus 4.5? How is the system built? What are the inputs, and what are the outputs? Why can only 50% be automated? Why can't it reach 99%?

Qiao:

Yes, this software was developed by our engineers. I believe the code itself is no longer the bottleneck; the key is designing the right "prompts." I wouldn't say this is a secret weapon because everyone knows some characteristics of excellent founders.

I simply converted these heuristics about great founders or successful startups into prompts to filter applications. Currently, the main function of this system is to eliminate obviously unqualified applications rather than directly telling me who the best candidates are, as I believe that part still requires the judgment of human interviewers. AI has not reached that level yet, but I believe that by the end of this year, you will see AI and AI-driven venture capitalists outperforming humans in this regard.

Yano: I think the prices of these tools are incredibly low right now, just like when Uber first launched, charging only $5 from the Financial District to the Upper East Side. At that time, you would think this price was obviously wrong, but they attracted users through venture capital subsidies.

How valuable do you think these tools are? How much do you think the current pricing of these tools is underestimated? For example, how much would you be willing to pay for Opus 4.5?

Qiao:

As for Opus, I'm not quite sure yet; it depends on what I can build with it. But for Gemini, I think its value is underestimated by at least two orders of magnitude. Right now, I only need to pay $20 to use its professional version, and I haven't even upgraded to Pro Plus.

Yano:If Gemini charged $2,000 a month, would you be willing to pay?

Qiao:

Yes, because its functionality is very powerful. In fact, I have mentioned on Twitter that it serves as a research assistant, a junior researcher, a junior code assistant, a pretty good medical consultant (to verify doctors' advice), and a decent legal assistant. Overall, if you combine these functionalities, the $2,000 price is simply a bargain.

Investment Decision in Google

Yano:How much time do you spend daily using applications like Gemini and Claude? What daily activities do you cut back on to make that time? For example, have you reduced Zoom meetings or spent less time on social media?

Qiao:

Actually, I analyzed my time allocation six months ago, which prompted my decision to invest in Google. I checked my iPhone usage records and found that the three applications I use the most are Chrome, YouTube, and Gemini, all of which are Google products.

Of course, I was initially concerned that ChatGPT would threaten Google's search business, so I discussed it with my wife. She gave me some insights, saying that the most common scenario in which she uses Google Search is for shopping, and in the short term, ChatGPT cannot fully replace that function. Then I did some research and found that actually over half of Google's search revenue comes from shopping ads, which made me feel that Google's core business is still very solid.

No one can shake its position in the short term. Additionally, Google has technological advantages like GCP (Google Cloud Platform) and TPU (Tensor Processing Unit), which are key points I realized later. I believe these factors indicate that Google's moat is very strong. Therefore, last year, I decided to invest in Google, which was almost my only significant investment last year.

Yano: On New Year's Eve last year, I had dinner with an employee from Google, and we talked about these things. Everyone was discussing the tools they commonly use. That Google employee mentioned that many people overlook a fact: Google possesses vast shopping data, and the market seems to not fully realize this. Are there other similar opportunities?

Qiao:

I think Adobe might be this year's Google because its current valuation is very cheap, and the market's perception of it is somewhat similar to how it viewed Google back then. In fact, I have never used it myself, but I know it has many use cases.

Yano:No new users will go to use Adobe. Just like Google, my commonly used application is YouTube, which I use very frequently, and I also use Gemini. But Adobe? I don't use it at all, so I don't think new users will choose Adobe either.

Qiao:

But all new users will use Google. I think a common misconception in the market is that Adobe is not a consumer product but an enterprise-level product.

Yano: It's true that it's an enterprise-level product, but my company wouldn't even consider using Adobe; Figma is more popular.

Qiao:

Figma and Adobe actually serve two different markets. In the market for new project presentations and website development, Adobe has already lost, and Figma dominates this field. What about Canva?

Yano:

Canva targets the low-end market and is more suitable for amateur users, while Adobe serves high-end enterprise users. So I agree with your point that Adobe's new user growth has indeed stagnated for a long time, but its pricing power is very strong, allowing it to continuously raise subscription fees.

How to Allocate Time Reasonably in 2026

Yano:As a Google user, I want to talk about investment, but I also want to explore a question: how should we allocate our time reasonably in 2026? How do you think artificial intelligence will change the way we allocate our time?

Qiao:

Well, I believe everyone should learn to code, and it is essential. If you don't do this, you may be left far behind. However, coding here does not mean traditional programming; it refers to optimizing certain aspects of your life and work through automation tools. I believe there will be many B2B SaaS software in the future, like Gmail and Zoom, for which people will still pay to use these general tools. But at the same time, there will be some specific needs in everyone's workflow that are very personalized, and third-party software companies may not develop targeted solutions for these needs.

Yano: For example, we can develop a commission calculator ourselves at Blockworks. That's a great example; no one will develop a dedicated SaaS software to do this.

Qiao:

Moreover, when I say "everyone should learn to code," it shouldn't be intimidating. Because current technology has made it so we don't need to write complex code anymore. You just need to converse with the system in natural language to achieve automation.

So, I would strongly recommend that everyone doesn't necessarily have to use complex tools like Claude Opus. I can recommend some simpler, more user-friendly tools. For example, Replit; it was through Replit that I first realized the potential of artificial intelligence. At that time, I understood that AI is not just a chatbot; it can help you build anything. This technology will fundamentally change our world. I highly recommend everyone to try Replit; it is really cool.

Yano:What impact do you think this gap will have on the labor market?

Qiao:

I think it will be like the proliferation of the internet; these tools will make those who are already efficient and capable even more efficient and smarter, while those who are inefficient may fall further behind. Artificial intelligence is an extremely powerful tool that can significantly enhance efficiency, but ultimately, it depends on how much you are willing to use it.

Investing Using AI Models

Yano:In a sense, from an opposing perspective, do you think the time you spent building the Warren Buffett stock tracker was really worth it?

Qiao:

Yes, it did take a considerable amount of my time. Although the results are quite good, more importantly, during the process of building this tool, I gained a deeper understanding of the relevant technologies.

This tool can be seen as a digital clone of investment masters like Warren Buffett, Charlie Munger, Howard Marks, Peter Drucker, and Bill Miller. It regularly scans thousands of stock codes and conducts in-depth research on each stock, attempting to simulate the investment logic of Buffett and Munger.

The coding part is actually quite simple, but designing the prompts took me months of repeated adjustments. I created a very detailed set of prompts to simulate the thought process of Buffett and Munger when evaluating potential investment opportunities.

This process is divided into six steps: first, it collects information on six key aspects they might focus on through a deep research model, then calls another API to analyze using a reasoning model. The deep research and reasoning models are two independent components.

The deep research model is very good at collecting facts and data, while the reasoning model, although it sometimes generates incorrect information, performs better in logical inference. Once accurate data is input into the reasoning model, its analytical capability far exceeds that of the deep research model.

Next, I will call the reasoning model in the second phase, allowing it to simulate the investment committee of "digital Buffett and Munger" to analyze whether it is worth investing in a particular stock. Ultimately, it will output a specific recommendation, which is the entire process.

Have you heard of a theory? Some believe that Renaissance Technologies discovered large language models (LLMs) before others, but they kept this technology secret, which might be why their investment returns are so high. However, my intention in designing the Buffett and Munger model was to avoid competition with Renaissance Technologies. They excel in short-term trading, such as day trading or operations within a week. On such short time scales, the latest AI models indeed find it difficult to compete.

Yano:So are you also competing with companies like Susquehanna?

Qiao:

That's right, but my model is more inclined towards long-term investment. In today's market, almost no one has the patience to hold a stock for more than 5 minutes, which is where language models can play a role.

Yano:So, how do you combine the advice of different investment masters? For example, Howard Marks' advice and Peter Drucker's advice might be completely different, and their thinking is quite the opposite of Buffett's.

Qiao: I weight their advice and consider it comprehensively.

Yano: Do they all recommend buying Adobe?

Qiao:

Yes, and an interesting phenomenon is that if you run the same prompt multiple times, the model may give different answers each time. So if you run the same question multiple times and average the results, and each time the result suggests buying a particular stock, then the credibility of that recommendation significantly increases.

It recommended about ten stocks, four of which are actually already in Berkshire Hathaway's portfolio, such as Chubb, an insurance company, and Google.

How AI is Changing Branding and Distribution?

Yano:How will AI change the way brands communicate and distribute content? For example, we previously mentioned Delphi, and I don't know if you've noticed OpenAI's recent launch of the Sora tool. With Sora, you can clone someone's image and embed it into your videos. This makes me think about the changes in marketing and branding. In the near future, brand marketing will clearly become more personalized.

Qiao:

This trend has actually already begun. A few days ago, I saw an ad on LinkedIn that said, "Hey, Jason, as a co-founder of Blockworks, I really think you would like Rippling."

Yano:

AI will make their advertising algorithms smarter, and ads will become very precise. In fact, a few days ago, I searched for a term online—High Rocks. It's a marathon-style fitness event similar to CrossFit, and I've been training for High Rocks recently, so I searched for fitness apps related to High Rocks in the App Store and found some apps specifically targeting High Rocks training. But High Rocks is a very niche activity, so there shouldn't be so many dedicated apps.

I found this strange, so I wondered if these apps were really designed for High Rocks or if they just customized ads for users searching for "High Rocks." Sure enough, these apps are actually some ordinary fitness and nutrition apps, but their advertising targets are very precise, so I believe this kind of customized advertising will become more common in the future.

Health and Longevity

Yano:What do you think is the most effective change in health?

Qiao:

Ultimately, the most important factors are still three basics: diet, sleep, and exercise. Back in 2021, I was very focused on optimizing details, trying various supplements, saunas, and other methods. But after four or five years of personal practice, reading a lot of research, and listening to countless podcasts, I found that nothing is more effective than getting 8 hours of sleep every day, maintaining a healthy diet, and sticking to regular exercise.

Yano:So how do you arrange your diet and exercise?

Qiao:

To be honest, I no longer pursue extreme optimization of my diet. Doing so stressed me out a lot. I just try to maintain a healthy diet without putting too much pressure on myself.

Yano: This reminds me of a neuroscience meme where the person in the middle prepares complex meals every day and takes 17 supplements in the morning. Your current attitude is "just eat healthily, no need to overthink it."

Qiao:

Yes, I found that if I try to optimize everything to the extreme, like Brian Johnson (note: Brian Johnson is known for extreme health management), I feel a lot of pressure. And stress can lead to elevated cortisol levels, which is not beneficial for longevity.

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