Babylon founder Fisher Yu talks to the Chinese community: 25 questions to clarify the matters of Bitcoin staking.

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1 year ago

Cheems:

Good evening, everyone. It's an honor to host a voice event at Bitcoin Square. I am OG from Babylon. Today's theme is to help everyone ask questions from a beginner's perspective. First, let's have Fisher introduce himself briefly.

Fisher:

My name is Fisher, co-founder and CTO of Babylon, responsible for leading the team in development and research. Babylon has been around for over two years. During this time, we have developed the Bitcoin timestamp protocol and the Bitcoin staking protocol. The recent attention and curiosity surrounding our Bitcoin staking protocol have prompted me to take this opportunity to fully communicate with everyone about our BTC staking technology. I hope to help everyone understand Babylon and the BTC ecosystem better. Thank you.

Question One: How do I stake my Bitcoin? Are there custodians? Who holds my Bitcoin?

In traditional Bitcoin staking protocols, there is a custodian concept. This means that users need to deposit their Bitcoin into a third-party wallet, such as a multi-signature wallet or threshold signature wallet. Therefore, these protocols are not trustless, and users must rely on and trust this third-party custodian.

However, Babylon's BTC staking model introduces a trustless mechanism, known as self-custody staking protocol. In this model, users do not need to give their Bitcoin to any third party, directly controlling their assets, thereby enhancing security and autonomy.

Regarding how to stake, our test network is already live. In the test network, users can experience BTC staking using BTC signet, meaning that no actual Bitcoin is staked, thus eliminating risk. Specifically, users need to generate a transaction on the Bitcoin network, creating the desired amount of Bitcoin to be staked as a UTXO. This UTXO will be locked using the Bitcoin network's time lock feature, and after the user signs it, it is sent to the Bitcoin network to complete the staking process.

Question Two: What are the staking rewards for Babylon? Do we earn BTC? Or other PoS tokens? Or can we choose freely?

Why stake BTC? Why does staking generate rewards? In Proof of Stake (PoS) blockchains, staking is crucial as it provides necessary security for the chain. By staking assets, they cannot be moved for a period, and the staker can become a network validator. As a validator, if you effectively perform validation work, you can earn staking rewards. Conversely, if you fail to fulfill your duties, the staked assets may be penalized.

These rewards come from your contribution to the network's security. BTC staking can be seen as using your Bitcoin to act as a "guardian" for a PoS chain. Therefore, the rewards you receive are not BTC, but the native tokens issued by the PoS chain you are protecting.

Additionally, we collaborate with some ecosystem partners whose protocols can run on Babylon, automatically converting the received PoS tokens into Bitcoin, allowing you to receive your rewards in native Bitcoin form. However, from the BTC staking protocol itself, your direct rewards come from the assets on the PoS side.

Question Three: How is staked capital allocated? Can I choose to protect multiple chains and earn various rewards?

Protecting multiple chains and earning various rewards is the core of what is known as restaking. Restaking allows one asset to be used to protect multiple chains or roll-up systems simultaneously. Therefore, by utilizing this BTC restaking protocol, you can simultaneously support multiple networks and receive diverse rewards. This method enhances the flexibility and potential returns of asset utilization, allowing participants to maximize the efficiency of their assets.

Question Four: What are the differences between Babylon's Bitcoin staking protocol and EVM staking protocol? And what is the staking and restaking relationship with Layer 2? Can you provide a simple example?

Staking on the EVM typically involves staking with native tokens, while BTC staking adds the option for Bitcoin (BTC) to be part of the staked assets.

Functionally, whether native tokens or BTC, the purpose and role of staking are the same: staked assets allow holders to become validators. If validators effectively perform their duties, they can earn staking rewards; if they do not, the staked assets may be penalized. Therefore, whether on the EVM or with Bitcoin, the fundamental function of staking is the same, providing reliable security for the chain.

As for the relationship between Babylon and Layer 2, some may mistakenly believe that Babylon is a Layer 2 solution for BTC, but this is not entirely accurate. Babylon actually brings Bitcoin's security and liquidity to Layer 2, whether it's Ethereum's Layer 2, Solana's Layer 2, or other native BTC Layer 2 networks, Babylon can support these platforms with Bitcoin, making them truly effective BTC Layer 2 networks.

Question Five: What is Babylon's latest roadmap?

From a technical perspective, our roadmap will first launch the Bitcoin staking mainnet, known as BTC Staking, to protect the first PoS chain. This inaugural PoS chain is called the Babylon chain. This marks a significant step from being unable to stake to being able to stake.

After completing this initial step, our next phase will introduce BTC Restacking, allowing already staked BTC to be restaked on other PoS chains and Layer 2 networks to generate more rewards. We expect all these features to be completed within this year.

The concept of restacking is currently receiving a lot of attention. Due to the surge in demand for Bitcoin staking, especially in the Layer 2 and DeFi fields, we are accelerating the development process. Our team is working around the clock and planning to collaborate with some high-quality projects within the ecosystem. Because our own team alone cannot meet the massive development demands, we are selecting ecosystem partners for parallel development.

Since the technology stacks of the Layer 2 chains are different, it is not feasible for us to develop all the features ourselves. Therefore, we will provide comprehensive documentation and high-quality samples to encourage ecosystem partners to participate in development. Additionally, we are considering providing corresponding rewards to facilitate this process.

Question Six: Last time, I didn't participate in the distribution of the 100,000 NFTs in the test network mainly because I couldn't receive test coins. Regarding this, are there any improvements for the next test network launch?

First, I would like to explain the difficulty in obtaining test coins in the previous test network. This issue may have arisen because the Signet test network we initially used was not operated by us but maintained by Bitcoin's core developers. For fairness, we did not initially set up our own faucet but allowed users to directly use the faucet maintained by Bitcoin's core developers.

One month before the official launch of the test network, we communicated with them and warned of the potential for a significant traffic load, to which they indicated no problem. Based on our trust in them, we initially had little concern. However, for safety reasons, we privately developed a backup faucet. As a result, just before the test network went live, the original BTC core developer faucet crashed due to excessive traffic, and we had to urgently deploy our own developed faucet within a few hours to allow users to receive test coins.

Regarding the slow distribution issue, it was not due to the faucet's capacity but rather the overwhelming number of participants. For example, when our NFT distribution period began, a large number of users rushed to the OKX market website to claim NFTs, even causing the website to crash. This reflects the immense pressure from the number of participants, rather than our unwillingness to provide sufficient resources.

Answer Seven:

For the upcoming test network, we will continue to use Signet, and our faucet will remain open. If anyone is interested in participating in the upcoming test network, they can continue to use our faucet to receive test coins. The current situation should not be too crowded, but there may be high pressure again when the next test network goes live.

Answer Eight:

The restaking concept mentioned in the recent project does not follow a style similar to EigenLayer. As for the minimum amount of Bitcoin required for small fans, in the Ethereum network, a typical validator node requires staking 32 ETH and running a validation node. If an individual does not have enough ETH to reach 32, they can choose to participate in staking by delegating to large validation services (such as Lido) to earn rewards. For BTC, the consensus mechanism is different from Ethereum, and it does not require thousands of validation nodes to maintain the network. BTC staking uses a delegable Proof of Stake (POS) model, allowing even small BTC holders to participate in network maintenance by delegating their BTC to a professional validation node.

Answer Nine:

The status of staking history can include "pending," "active," "unbonding," "withdrawable," and "withdrawn." If a community member has staked but did not receive rewards, they can use Mempool and the Babylon website to troubleshoot the issue.

Answer Ten:

The staking time is determined by the number of BTC blocks being staked. For example, staking 1,000 BTC blocks would equate to approximately 150 hours, or about 7 days, as BTC blocks are generated approximately every 10 minutes.

Answer Eleven:

The calculation formula for Babylon rewards follows a similar pattern to regular Proof of Stake (PoS) systems, where rewards come from transaction fees and inflation, distributed to validators and stakers. The specific allocation ratio is yet to be finalized due to the ongoing test network phase.

Answer Twelve:

The staking process involves various statuses, including "pending," "active," "unbonding," "withdrawable," and "withdrawn." Each status has specific implications in the staking process.

Answer Thirteen:

The main focus of the mainnet is currently on Bitcoin (BTC) staking. While there are plans to explore the inclusion of other asset types, such as BRC-20 and ARC-20, the primary focus remains on Bitcoin at the moment.

Answer Fourteen:

The development of the Babylon test network's block explorer is in progress, and the browser is already functional. Users can access more information and browse through the browser by visiting the website babylonscan.io.

Answer Fifteen:

I cannot answer this question.

I'm sorry, this needs to be kept somewhat mysterious, so everyone should actively participate in the activities of the new test network.

Question Fifteen: When will the coins be issued?

I cannot answer the question about issuing coins.

Question Sixteen: Regarding the BTC staking collaboration between Babylon and Cosmos, is it better to integrate directly with Babylon or to wait for Cosmos BTC staking to be completed and then join Cosmos Hub to use Bitcoin staking?

Cosmos refers specifically to Cosmos Hub, the Atom chain. It is a completely different choice. Cosmos Hub's security is shared through ICS interchain security, which is cross-chain security.

If you choose ICS, your validator node will be part of the Atom network. Different chains may have different attitudes towards this choice. Some may find it convenient as they don't have to find their own validator nodes, while others may feel it increases their dependency on Cosmos Hub and may not want to do it. Therefore, you can choose to integrate directly with Babylon or go through ICS.

Question Seventeen: What is the positioning of the Babylon chain?

Bitcoin staking (BTC Staking) constitutes a bilateral market with a supply side and a demand side. The supply side consists of Bitcoin holders who provide necessary network security by staking their Bitcoin, while the demand side includes PoS chains and layer 2 solutions that need this security to protect their networks. These demand-side entities are willing to provide rewards to Bitcoin stakers in exchange for security.

In this market structure, there is a significant supply-demand relationship, requiring a neutral market platform to facilitate effective matching between supply and demand. Babylon plays the role of such a market platform, helping demand-side entities find reliable security supply and ensuring that supply-side entities receive appropriate rewards.

Additionally, Babylon itself will be the first PoS chain protected by BTC staking. For Bitcoin holders participating in staking, the rewards are similar to a basic salary, aimed at encouraging more BTC holders to join and participate in BTC staking. This incentive mechanism not only enhances network security but also provides additional income sources for Bitcoin holders, promoting the overall ecosystem's activity and healthy development.

Question Eighteen: With many projects now focusing on Bitcoin staking, how does Babylon view this phenomenon? Do you have confidence in winning in this battle?

My answer is divided into two parts. First, I want to explain why BTC L2 is currently so popular. Second, I want to talk about Babylon's position in this ecosystem.

The first part is about why BTC L2 is so popular. Currently, the narrative around Ethereum's scalability is relatively mature, focusing mainly on performance optimization, reducing transaction fees, and storage costs. This indicates that there are no significant breakthroughs in the narrative, and the focus has shifted to technical details and performance improvements.

For Layer 2 (L2) networks, they primarily seek support from Layer 1 in three key areas: security, user base, and asset liquidity. L2 networks need the security guarantee of Layer 1 to be considered secure and to gain widespread use. They also hope to directly leverage the large user base of Layer 1 to avoid the difficult process of accumulating users from scratch. Additionally, L2 networks need asset liquidity from Layer 1 to efficiently use these assets on L2 and promote economic activity.

Although Ethereum can provide the necessary security, user base, and liquidity for L2, Bitcoin has unique advantages in these areas. Bitcoin's security is globally recognized as the highest, it has a broad and diverse user base, and its asset value is immense. Effective utilization of Bitcoin's liquidity would be a significant advantage for L2 networks. Therefore, with Ethereum's narrative weakening and the significant advantages that Bitcoin can provide, more developers and projects may choose to develop L2 solutions on the Bitcoin platform.

This shift may lead to a new development trend, directing more innovation and resources towards Bitcoin, further expanding its ecosystem's functionality and application scope.

As for Babylon's role in the BTC ecosystem, it is not a direct extension of Bitcoin but an independent protocol and network that serves as a market platform. Through advanced cryptography and mathematical methods, Babylon can provide Bitcoin's security, attract Bitcoin's user base, and increase Bitcoin's liquidity for various L2 networks. This allows any L2 network integrated with Babylon to access the necessary resources and become a genuine Bitcoin L2 solution.

Therefore, Babylon does not directly compete with Bitcoin's L2 networks. Instead, Babylon's role is more of an enabler, helping other L2 networks leverage Bitcoin's powerful capabilities to expand their applications and services. The existence of Babylon actually strengthens the entire Bitcoin ecosystem, making it more diverse and robust.

Question Nineteen: When is the approximate time for the next phase of the test network? Is it the final test network?

The next test will be in May. According to our plan, it should be the final test network. Once this test network goes live, it will mark the launch of the first phase of the main network. That's our plan.

Question Twenty: Are there any POS chains currently under consideration? Will they be used in the end?

Our BD team is currently maintaining about 200 Telegram channels, mainly related to various PoS networks or roll-up solutions. This seemingly complex approach is because many projects are seeking so-called "BTC alignment." This refers to maintaining consistency with Bitcoin in terms of security, user base, and liquidity.

Babylon's Bitcoin staking service is designed to meet the needs of these projects, helping them achieve alignment with Bitcoin, ensuring that they can enjoy the core advantages provided by the Bitcoin network: high security, a broad user base, and strong liquidity. These three factors collectively constitute the core value of Bitcoin staking and are the main reasons why various L2 networks and other blockchain projects seek alignment with Bitcoin.

Question Twenty-One: Regarding the timing of the second mainnet, is there a rough plan now?

Our goal is to complete the launch of all basic functions, including staking and restaking, before the end of the year. When discussing our roadmap, I mentioned our plan to strive for the full implementation of these core functions within this year. At the same time, we have made it clear that not all restaking-related projects will be launched simultaneously. We plan to collaborate with some outstanding teams to jointly promote the development of the BTC ecosystem.

As a neutral market platform, we do not selectively support projects. Our role is to provide a fair environment for various projects to showcase and develop on our platform. This way, we can not only help excellent projects grow but also ensure that our platform provides diverse and high-quality services, attracting and meeting a broader range of user needs. This open and neutral strategy is crucial for driving the healthy development of the ecosystem.

Question Twenty-Two: After Babylon issues its own token, will it use its token to reward BTC stakers?

Babylon will be the first chain protected by BTC staking, so the first reward received by BTC stakers will be from Babylon.

Question Twenty-Three: Regarding staking rewards, since BTC staking does not generate income, all income comes from the POS chain. Currently, the market value of BTC is over 1 trillion, and assuming 10% of it, which is over 100 billion, is used for staking on the POS chain, and assuming a 3% return, it would yield an annualized income of 30 billion, all of which comes from the POS chain. Does this mean that the staking limit of Babylon is completely locked by the staking income provided by the POS chain?

Indeed, Bitcoin itself does not have a staking mechanism in its native protocol, so it is inaccurate to discuss direct staking rewards for Bitcoin. Because Bitcoin does not support native Proof of Stake (PoS) mechanisms, it does not provide staking income at the protocol level. Therefore, from a technical and protocol perspective, Bitcoin is "risk-free" because there is no systemic risk directly caused by staking.

However, through third-party platforms or cross-chain technology, Bitcoin can indirectly participate in staking activities on other blockchain networks, such as through specific DeFi projects or PoS chains. This indirect staking allows Bitcoin holders to potentially earn rewards by participating in the security or operation of other chains.

As for the specific income from these staking activities, it is indeed determined by market supply and demand. If there is high demand in the market for the security or other services provided by Bitcoin, it may offer higher rewards to attract Bitcoin stakers. As more participants join, the rewards may be diluted accordingly, creating market equilibrium. When demand strengthens, it may attract more staking, creating a dynamic cycle.

In this process, market platforms like Babylon play a crucial role. They not only act as intermediaries to match demand and supply but also strive to promote the prosperity and healthy development of the entire blockchain ecosystem. Through such platforms, we hope to not only bring more earning opportunities to Bitcoin holders but also foster growth and prosperity for the entire PoS and L2 network ecosystem, creating a positive ecosystem cycle. The goal of this "positive cycle" is to make the entire blockchain world more prosperous and healthy, benefiting all participants.

Question Twenty-Four:

Sometimes, new members encounter operational issues in group chats, such as the reward claim button being unclickable or rewards not being received after clicking. When troubleshooting these issues, we usually check the block explorer and related websites. Due to our lack of familiarity with the entire process, we sometimes find it difficult to resolve issues promptly, and the team's response may be slow. Therefore, we hope to learn some basic troubleshooting methods or approaches to better help new members solve problems.

Thank you very much for your detailed feedback and support for our Telegram management. Recently, our team investigated an issue reported by a user named J. He mentioned that his account was unbound without any action on his part. After a day of investigation, we found that he had accidentally clicked the "unbound" button, and he had forgotten about this action.

Initially, we thought it was due to the Signet test network's fast block generation speed. Later, we realized that he had inadvertently triggered a feature in our staking function, which allows users to unlock their staked assets ahead of the set time lock (e.g., unlocking after six months or a year). This flexibility is one of our design features. After clicking the early unlock button, his BTC had safely returned to his account.

Additionally, regarding the issue of rewards showing as 0, we also conducted troubleshooting and found that it was due to the reward value being too small, causing the frontend to display an incomplete value. We will improve the frontend to more accurately display such information. Furthermore, regarding the unclickable claim button issue, we found that it was due to high API access causing slow response times. We will optimize this and, based on community feedback, add more beginner guides and tutorials to help new users better understand and use our system.

We look forward to the launch of the second phase of the test network and the future mainnet, when more users will join us. Once again, thank you for your suggestions and support. We will continue to strive to provide better service and support.

Question Twenty-Five: The COSMOS, IBC, and AGENDA ecosystems, what are the technical similarities and differences?

In fact, we are doing the same thing, called security sharing. Within the Cosmos ecosystem, it is further divided into two paths. The first path is Cosmos Hub, which is Atom's ICS. The other way is called match security, which means mutual protection. This concept was proposed by Sunny Algo, the founder of Osmosis. So, it is security sharing.

EigenLayer also does security sharing. It uses Ethereum's staking assets to protect other ABS. So, it is also a form of security sharing. Babylon's BTC staking security comes from BTC. Therefore, when comparing the technical aspects, there are four different sources of security. In Cosmos Hub, the security comes from the $Atom coin.

In COSMOS, security comes from everyone huddling together. EigenLayer's security comes from Ethereum. Babylon's BTC staking security comes from BTC. So, we are aiming to achieve the same thing, but the sources of security are different. Perhaps the most interesting comparison is between Babylon and EigenLayer. EigenLayer is doing what Ethereum does from 1 to 10. Why do I say this? Because Ethereum already supports staking, and EigenLayer allows it to restake. So, it is a big step from 1 to 10. Babylon does more than EigenLayer, it goes from 0 to 10. What is 0 to 1? It's BTC, which originally couldn't be staked, but we made it stakable. So, this is the 0 to 1 step. After making it stakable, we then do restaking from 1 to 10. Therefore, Babylon does 0-10 for BTC, while EigenLayer does 1-10 for Ethereum. This is the technical difference between the two.

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